", DRAWMason Capital vs. Telus (2012)Acting for Mason "One of the toughest battles I have been involved in. Wes Hall (businessman) Books only: No Bootstraps When You're Barefoot: My Rise from a Jamaican Plantation Shack to the Boardrooms of Bay Street, Wes Hall (businessman) Education: George Brown College - Casa Loma Campus - C Building. TORONTO-- ( BUSINESS WIRE )-- Kingsdale Advisors, North America's most trusted strategic shareholder advisory firm, today released its 2020 . Continuous Play: ON OFF Fri Feb 03 Sat Feb 04 Sun Feb 05 Mon Feb 06 Tue Feb 07 Wed Feb 08 Wes Hall is an established innovator, entrepreneur and philanthropist. Rosenstein and Jana chief legal officer Charles Penner outlined their two major frustrations with Agrium: legal and procedural tactics that they felt were questionable, and the insular attitude that Canadians have to foreign investors who just want to help them get better returns. ", The insularity is a basic frustration that almost all U.S. shareholder activists seem to share. Welcome back! It lost the vote, but only because Front Street voted its shares in favour of its own management agreement. biogen senior engineer ii salary. Net Worth 2020. Kingsdale Shareholder Services Inc., was started in 2003 and Kingsdale Communications Inc., started in 2009 to provide clients with a best-in-class mechanism for communicating with shareholders and managing IR communications. My man's got a steady diet. Famous musicians, Hollywood stars, politicians and athletes came for the food and vibe. Chairman and Founder, WeShall Investments Inc., Kingsdale Advisors, The BlackNorth Initiative, Dragon on CBC's Dragons' Den, Host "Between Us with Wes Hall" Podcast. CBC/Radio-Canada is Canadas national public broadcaster. As Pershing Square's ownership interest approached the 10 per cent thresholdat which it would have to formally disclose its holdings publiclyhe had some preliminary phone conversations with Cleghorn. "You are a board that proved that if you play dirty enough, violate all precepts of good corporate governance, fair play, ethical behaviour and democracy, you can still lose the campaign but then barely manufacture a victory after the voting is supposed to be over.". Wes Hall net worth is $4 Million Wes Hall Wiki: Salary, Married, Wedding, Spouse, Family Sir Wesley Winfield Hall (born 12 September 1937) is a Barbadian former cricketer and politician. No credit card required. standing at 6 feet 3 inches tall. If not for that, however, the vote would have gone in VN's favour. Wesley J. He re-joined his mom at 11, but she kicked him out at 13 and he lived on his own until 16, when he decided to move to Canada to get to know his dad, a factory worker. He is one of the richest NFL players and hence the richest athletes. In 2003, Hall left Georgeson to launch Kingsdale. Whats she doing hoarding a big old home in Rosedale, when she should be in Florida zooming around in a golf cart? West Indies Cricket Hall of Famer who played international cricket for West Indies. Their overhead costs consist of rent and a Bloomberg terminal in total, about $70,000 a year. This article was published more than 9 years ago. He says that we can't just give lip service anymore. So, if you have nothing to lose, why not just give things a shot? Whether Hall is playing offence or defence, however, he often has to be the bad cop. Articles by Wes Hall on Muck Rack. "But a proxy fight is not a pillow fight.". "Our goal is to be number one," he says. Advisor. So far, activist investors on both sides of the border still appear to be more inspired by Ackman's CP victory than Rosenstein's Agrium defeat. Wes Hall spent his early childhood in a zinc-roofed shack, one of several children supported by his grandmother. He also consulted Wes Hall on the recommendation of his respected and tough-minded Canadian securities lawyer, Patricia Olasker of Davies Ward Phillips & Vineberg, who had acted for Ackman in disputes with Canadian Tire in 2006 and Sears Canada in 2010. He has established himself as the preeminent leader in shareholder advisory services and contested investor situations. police officer relieved of duty. #buylocal #supportblackbusiness #bookrecommendations, You reflect what you are. Vanasek and Noone never considered themselves activists. He admits that Hall fired him over "differences," and adds that turnover at Kingsdale has helped populate decent competition like Phoenix. In the first episode of a groundbreaking series that explores the journeys of BIPOC visionaries in Canada, the entrepreneur sits down with iconic Canadian rapper Kardinal Offishall for a frank and. . Hall, who is one of North America's most influential power brokers, founded Kingsdale Advisors 18 years ago, at the age of 34. "We like to invest $1-billion in a company. Hall, 44, the polished but blunt CEO of Toronto-based Kingsdale Shareholder Services Inc., had estimated the shareholder votes for and against management's current slate of directors. Does Victor Dodig no longer care about Black people? Just know he is living well. Doctor of Laws, JD Hon. Vanasek and Noone were frustrated by the time and effort it took, but satisfied with the outcome. Hall says that he has talked to the OSC about it. The broad strategy for both sides is to meet with the biggest pension funds and institutional investors one-on-one to pitch your case the CPP Investment Board, Ontario Teachers, the Caisse de dpt and the biggest private-sector firms, such as BlackRock and Fidelity. Skip to content . Talking about his body measurement, he has high of 6feet, 1 inch, and a weight of 77kg. She wasnt resentful. Talking about the net worth of Wes brown it's around 10million pounds as of 2022. CBC today announced that a new Dragon will enter the Den for Season 16 of DRAGONS DEN .Wes Hall, Executive Chairman and Founder of Kingsdale Advisors and Founder and Chairman of The BlackNorth Initiative, brings a diverse range of expertise to the Den. Big thanks to Itah for providing a safe space to learn at the @blackhurstculturalcentre and teaching us how integral the Black community has been in shaping Canadian history. Plus, both Dragon Arlene Dickenson and public intellectual Ben Mulroney endorse the book. Cest comme a que je taime (Happily Married), THE NO-GOOD, TERRIBLY KIND, WONDERFUL LIVES AND TRAGIC DEATHS OF BARRY AND HONEY SHERMAN. As a child in rural Jamaica, he was raised by his grandmother; he moved to Canada at 16, and set himself on track to become one of the most influential business people in Canada. This year's theme focused on celebrating diversity in business, particularly marginalized entrepreneurs. Wanna follow Wes Hall (businessman)'s net worth? What does a proxy specialist do? Wes Welker gets a salary of $9.5 million, and he has an estimated net worth of $25 million, as of February 2023. Wes is reported to have earned over $298,000 on the show. "It's a new game of social arbitrage, where we don't care about offending people," says Roy Katzovicz, Ackman's partner and the firm's chief legal officer. On Monday, Jana issued a release complaining that Agrium had contacted shareholders after the deadline, urging them to change their votewhich the company was legally entitled to do. "My client decided not to do so. At sixteen, Wes came to Canada, sponsored by a father he'd only seen a few times as a child, and by the time he was eighteen, he was out of his father's house, once more on his own. As Executive Chairman and Founder of Kingsdale Advisors and The BlackNorth Initiative, he has been repeatedly named one of Canada's most powerful people by The Globe and Mail, Canadian Business, Toronto Life and Maclean's. Hes also a proud investor and supporter of many burgeoning small businesses. This was the spot for anyone who wanted to be seen. "Its all in the body language. Jana had approached the company the same way Pershing Square had started with CP: with a detailed plan for the board to increase shareholder returns, including increasing its dividend, splitting Agrium's retail and wholesale businesses, cutting costs and replacing five directors. Cleghorn argued that Green was working on a multiyear turnaround strategy, and that Ackman really had no plan. Some information may no longer be current. Hall is also titled the Best Canadian Business Leader of The World in 2022. wes hall net worth 2020 June 5, 2022 5:15 pm nahl combine 2022 dates nahl combine 2022 dates "Either side could have done it," he says. If the circumstances of Wes Halls childhood werent harsh enough, as a teenager, he had the misfortune of immigrating to a country with systemic racism - you guessed it, our very own Great White North. All right reserved. Its the no. Goldcorp was close to finalizing a deal to take over Wheaton River Minerals when Glamis launched a shareholder challenge and a hostile bid for Goldcorp. FTC: Black Entrepreneur & Executive Profiles is reader supported, we may earn income on affiliate links. I was hesitant to help her because I was concerned she would be startled by a Black man helping her, or that the neighbours would call the police on a Black man standing over an elderly white woman. This post is based on a their Kingsdale memorandum. Yet Wes Hall went on to become a major entrepreneur, business leader, philanthropist, and change-maker, working his way up from a humble position in a law firm mailroom by way of his intelligence, his curiosity, and his ability to see opportunities that other people don't. Wes Hall is also a self-proclaimed philanthropist with $5,021 in his foundation as of 2020. Under Canadian securities law, those commissions are legal (although more common in M&A transactions), but Jana did not pay them. The pair got their start in 2002, with backing from Joseph Rich, one of the progenitors of the original money market fund, who took a 20 per cent stake in the firm. Wes Hall, executive chairman of Toronto-based Kingsdale Advisors, is on a mission to eliminate anti-Black systemic racism By: Greg Dalgetty August 21, 2020 00:09 Courtesy Kingsdale Advisors Wes Hall knew the stakes were high when he built Kingsdale Advisors from the ground up back in 2003. The Canadian Broadcasting Corporate (CBC) announced that Wes Hall, the Jamaican-born executive chair and founder of Kingsdale Advisors and the BlackNorth initiative will participate in Season 16 of the network's reality television show "Dragons Den." Hall has been named to The Power List of the 50 most powerful people in Canada by Maclean's If youre constantly being let down by them or displeased with them, maybe its time to look inward and wonder if youre doing the same to others. Net Worth. Hall, ICD.D Executive Chairman and Founder, Kingsdale Advisors Founder, BlackNorth Initiative Wes Hall came from very humble beginnings in Jamaica to become one of the most influential business people in Canada. Dragons Den Canada's investor Wes Hall has a net worth in billions. As the Executive Chairman and Founder of Kingsdale Advisors, he has delivered an unparalleled track record of success leading some of the highest profile deals and activist campaigns in North America. To further explore Kingsdale's The New Abnormal: How 2020 Has Changed the Future of Corporate Governance, Kingsdale will host a virtual presentation on Thursday, October 1, 2020, at 12pm EST to . Then they invested in Ceres Global. Its unfortunate that such considerations entered his mind. I see something that needs to be done, and I always step in and try to figure it out. But if I wanted a feel-good Jamaican-Canadian story, I would have re-watched Cool Runnings. Who's your favourite BIPOC author I should add to my list? After 15 seasons and an incredible history of betting on winners, Treliving plans to focus on his role as Chairman of Boston Pizza International, in addition to remaining active with his other commitments as a business advisor, investor, entrepreneur and dedicated philanthropist. Many people ask this question about the money Wes Hall (businessman) makes from Facebook. Kingsdale's first victory was sweet! Vice President, National Sales, Georgeson Shareholder Communications Canada, Inc. Assistant Corporate Secretary, CanWest Global Communications Corp. This is just a sample: We still offer a free subscription tier (aka Blind Squirrels). That was a step that I never thought that I would ever take, to leave that environment to come to Canada, he said. Im excited to join Dragons Den and sit alongside some of our countrys biggest and brightest business minds, said Hall. Ontario Securities Commission chairman Howard Wetston realizes that the activists are getting more popular. Check your email for magic link to sign-in. You just do it because nothing is worse than that environment.. Formation Metals (June, 2013)Acting for Formation "The dissident had 17 per cent, and the company started with zero. He earned the money being a professional Cricket Player. Wes Hall was born on September 12, 1937 in Barbados. Interestingly, I learned that TIFF had total assets of $101m (mostly land and buildings). Their bill for the whole activist affair? Wes Hall (businessman) net worth 94.3 Million Millions of dollars 99% Net worth score Disclamer: Wes Hall (businessman) net worth displayed here are calculated based on a combination social factors. Dr. Wesley J. Hes orchestrated multi-billion-dollar deals for Air Canada, Citigroup, Tim Hortons, and Petro Canada and is #16 on Macleans Power List of 50 influential Canadians. He charges three times what everybody else charges on his reputation." Number of Founded Organizations 1. Through our mandate to inform, enlighten and entertain, we play a central role in strengthening Canadian culture. At first, keeping discussions behind closed doors appeared to yield results. This is how you do a Horatio Alger story! We won by 250,000 votes. I marvel at what he could have accomplished in a country that wasnt beset with white supremacy. And shareholder activism was heating up in Canada, particularly in the mining sector. . At the end of the day I had an opportunity to say yes to it, he said, and, as a result of saying, yes, Im guaranteed that its going to open the doors for others like me in the future.. I was honoured to see the cover proudly displayed on this iconic bookstore's shelves and humbled to learn about our community's deep history in the Annex neighbourhood of Toronto. To Be Hosted is an events and media company specializing in dinner, When The Network Journal (TNJ) in 2017 asked Thasunda Brown Duckett to tell us the three most important things she would like people to know about, Two Ethiopians have filed a lawsuit in Kenyas High Court in Nairobi against US tech giant Meta, the owner of Facebook, for failing to prevent the, If you're looking to take your business to the next level, joining an entrepreneurial community can be a great way to do it. Backed and managed by the private boutique investment firm Front Street Capital, Ceres had what VN considered to be an overly aggressive two-and-20 management compensation structure typical of a private equity partnership (that is, 2 per cent of total assets, plus 20 per cent of profits earned) except that it was a publicly traded company and owner of hard assets. Summary. "We went down to as little as 100,000 shares," he says. But barriers don't scare activists. With offices in Toronto and New York, Kingsdale Advisors is the leading advisor to public companies on all shareholder, governance, and transaction-related matters, having acted on the largest and highest profile proxy fights, transactions, and other special situations. I'd like to see this stack get higher, and I'm sure I will as more and more BIPOC voices are being heard and recorded. He is from United States. #cbcdragonsden https://t.co/Q6AFqY9ryi, @cityoftoronto really dumb what you just installed at Ave/Roxborough. ", Calgary-based CP looked like a particularly fat target in the fall of 2011. Having come from a tin shack with no electricity or running water, but which had an outhouse, and living in luxury because his house has running water, electricity, and a bathroom, Hall noted that differs from others who dont want to lose their possessions or reputation by taking on something risky. I have now read the book and am mulling my verdict. What are some of the hidden gems you have uncovered? Admissions to the school are coordinated by the Southwark London Borough Council as part of the Pan London Admissions Arrangements. Hall says he told Ackman to be careful, because CP was a historic Canadian company with a well-connected board. Age, Bio, Height, Salary in 2022. Follow us on Twitter: @globebusinessOpens in a new window, Checking box will enable automatic data updates. Wes Hall, Barbados Cricket Player. Peter Jones: 450 Million: 2. Daniel Radcliffe, Robert Pattinson, and Emma Watson have a reported combined net worth of approximately $290 million. But its not that I want people to think highly of me or pat me on the back. Wes Hall is on the board of the Hospital for Sick Children Foundation. In 2006, the firm became a major player in Canadian business when it managed Xstrata's purchase and takeover of Falconbridge. The Coordinator, Residence Support will assist the Residence Managers and act as the first point of contact for programming and student engagement within the residence community at Huron. ", WINStephen Joffe vs. TLC Vision (June, 2008) Acting for TLC"We prepared a very strong campaign and, when the other side saw it, they withdrew and ended the fight. He is the Founder and Chairman of The Canadian Council of Business Leaders Against Anti-Black Systemic Racism and The BlackNorth Initiative, committed to the removal of anti-Black systemic barriers negatively affecting the lives of Black Canadians. Wes Hall is an Executive Chairman & Founder at Kingsdale Advisors based in Toronto, Ontario. Ackman began buying shares in September. Last month, he made an estimated $688-million profit on his 20.8 million shares in whisky maker Beam Inc. when the company agreed to be acquired by Japan's Suntory. The BlackNorth Initiative is committed to increasing the representation of Blacks in the boardrooms and executive suites across Canada. ", LOSSJana Partners vs. Agrium (April, 2013)Acting for Jana"A fight that was dubbed unwinnable came down to the wire in the end. The sold-out event featured a West African drummer, Black and Ukrainian artists, and a keynote address by Wes Hall, Chairman and Founder, Kingsdale Advisors, Founder of the BlackNorth . Save . He lived in a two bedroom tin shack without indoor plumbing or electricity, on the salary of a plantation worker supporting seven children in the most impoverished parish of Jamaica. His crowning achievement was maneuvering along with Bill Ackman to oust the blue blood board of Canadian Pacific and installing Hunter Harrison as CEO. . Not known Before Fame. Police suspected drug ties. For historical image resources, please contact the CBC Image Research Library, which has an extensive archive of still photography dating back to the 1950's. (Reuters) - Wes Hall, a prominent Canadian businessman and chairman of proxy advisory firm Kingsdale Advisors, on Wednesday launched a group to fight racism and improve the representation of. In 2003, he founded Kingsdale Advisors to help businesses communicate better with shareholders. Wes Hall's Net Worth: $1-5 Million Age, Height & Body Measurements Wes Hall is currently age 81 years old. His net worth has been growing significantly in 2021-2022. Wes Hall starts from a much lower base and arguably rises much farther, becoming an advisor to hedge fund titans and CEOs. He got the Wheaton deal approved by shareholders, then helped engineer a merger between Goldcorp and Glamis. There is also still a palpable suspicion of Americans. Kingsdale Foundation School (KFS) is a British mixed secondary school with academy status in West Dulwich, London, with an age range of 11-19 (Year 7 to sixth form). These communities provide. Mr. Hall is known for his generosity, leveraging his business success to benefit others with a number of impactful charitable initiatives, and serves as a Board Member of the SickKids Foundation. They plot strategy, control written communications to investors, stage cross-country tours, corral shareholder votes and whip their candidatesbe it the activist or the target companyinto shape, keeping them focused and on-message. The chief executive's company was facing a showdown with an activist investor at a shareholders' meeting in just a few days. As the Founder of Kingsdale Advisors, Mr. Hall has delivered an unparalleled track record of success for North Americas biggest names including: - Air Canada - Barrick - BHP Billiton - Citigroup - CN - CP - Ovintiv - Goldcorp - Talisman - Suncor He has been sought out to lead some of the highest profile deals and activist campaigns in North America including: Enbridges $37 billion merger with Spectra Energy, Agrium and Potash Corp.s $36 billion merger. I would guess that his net worth now is north of $100m. So f*** her, you know what I mean? "When I wanted to start Kingsdale, it was hard to get backing and I had to find someone who looked like me and believed in my vision to start this business," Hall recounts. Hall also says that roughly a dozen companies have paid him to simply sit on the sidelines during disputes. Born: May 08, 1969, Golden Grove, Saint Thomas, Jamaica. Skip to main content Management Information Circular 2022 - French About Us Who We Are Along with Scotiabank CEO Brian Porter, Norton Rose chair Walied Soliman and many other potentates. Stylish and supremely confident, the 47-year-old Ackman is CEO of Pershing Square Capital Management, an $11-billion (U.S.) New York-based hedge fund that has taken aim at more than two dozen high-profile targets since Ackman founded it in 2004. In early childhood, Wes Hall was abandoned by his parents and eventually cared for by his grandmother. Almost all of his early clients were small mining companies, but his work on the complicated dispute between Toronto-based Goldcorp and Nevada-based Glamis Gold, from 2004 to 2006, kicked him into a higher league. If you skip this story, what does that say about you? The most important thing is to ensure that investors have received the documents and forms they are legally required to have before they can vote. The couple have five children, aged 3 to 18. In an SEC filing in mid-October, Pershing Square said it held 12.2 per cent of CP's shares, and that it planned to talk with executives about "the business, management, operations, assets, capitalization, financial condition, governance, strategy and future plans of the issuer.". "I have so much gratitude for the production team at CBC. Please only use it for a guidance and Wes Hall (businessman)'s actual income may vary a lot from the dollar amount shown above. The Underground Railroad saw enslaved African-Americans gain their freedom through a carefully organized yet harrowing North American-wide transportation mode. He is a Jehovah's Witness who shuns the traditional Bay Street salesman's fare of drinks and smokes, but he's also an elegant dresser expensive tailor-made suits and shirts with cufflinks. ", WINGoodwood vs. Pet Valu (May, 2008) Acting for Goodwood "Won the fight even though management had over 30 per cent of the stock. He's CBC Dragon's Den's first Black dragon. #fridaysforfuture #fridayquotes #weekendmotivation #tgif, People say you can't choose your family, but I'd still pick them even if I had the choice. However, many students live in surrounding boroughs, such as Lambeth, Lewisham and Croydon. Canadian Business Leader. Hall shrugs off potshots. Most recently, Hall made headlines when he founded The BlackNorth Initiative, which he believes can end anti-Black systemic racism by using a business-first mindset to create more opportunities for Blacks and all of those in the BIPOC community across Canada. Hes also the founder and executive chairman of both the Black North Initiative, which is challenging Canadian businesses to set data-driven diversity targets and dismantle racism, and Canadian Council of Business Leaders Against Anti-Black Systemic Racism. Its 2023 and Ira Gluskin is still around. Regulating proxy monitoring services is another possibility. It stated that Green and at least six directors had to be replaced with Ackman's nominees. Recently named to Macleans Power List ranking of the 50 most powerful people in Canada, Hall is an innovator and entrepreneur who is revered as one of Canadas preeminent power brokers. To the viewers of the show, I cant thank you enough for your support and kindness over the years., From building a safe digital world in Club Penguin to capturing their learning with FreshGrade, my ventures have always been inspired by my kids, said Merrifield. Photo by Peter J. Thompson/National Post Wes Hall wears expensive suits, drives a fancy sports car, collects art and lives in a yellow-brick mansion in Toronto's exclusive Rosedale neighbourhood. Success! Causa.. Institute of Corporate Directors, Rotman School of Management, University of Toronto. As a life-long entrepreneur, I know first-hand how much drive and dedication it takes to build a business, especially as a Black person in Canada. In the case of Ackman or other large clients, that service includes having Hall attend meetings with the big-fish shareholders, and taking part in candid, off-the-record conversations with the other side. Entrepreneur tells WP about his journey from a tin shack to corporate boards and Dragons' Den, and why he still feels he has nothing to lose. Once a Dragon, always a Dragon - and while we will miss them in the Den, we look forward to seeing what they do next.". For further information and press materials, please contact: All content including images on this site are intended for Media use only. December 17, 2020 08:00 AM Eastern Standard Time. Who https://t.co/f5rsP3D5rh, Christine and I go for a leisurely stroll every weekend. Kingsdale has more than 60 employees, and a big campaign like CP requires help from almost all of them. Hall says it was actually an attempt to make performance, not personality, the issue. Wes Hall is an established innovator, entrepreneur, and philanthropist. "They didn't realize they had so many U.S. shareholders who have no clue what the Order of Canada is.". Mr. Hall's net worth of ~ $375 million is only an estimate we calculated based on unreliable public figures of annual revenue for his companies. On one wall of his office is a "Hall of Fame," with nine framed congratulatory letters from big clients. Net Worth: ( 01/03/2023 ): ~ USD $0.38 Billion. Hall began his career in that routine end of the business in the 1990s. Wes Hall Wiki, Career, Relationship, Nationality, Ethnicity. Frankly, its a 50/50 in my mind that she fell on purpose just to inflict such a painful dilemma on Wes Hall. I am touched by Gilles drive, bravery, and will https://t.co/CtP8dBrbXN, RT @colindeacon: Im behind in my @cbcdragons episodes. View Wes Hall's business profile as Executive Chairman & Founder at Kingsdale Advisors. He'll give his last dollar to someone in need. Hall says that he set up more than 50 of those meetings over the next four months. Check the people you hang around with its like looking in the mirror. 2022 Canadian Business Leader of the Year. Hall says he hails from a "typical Jamaican family, where you have many brothers and sisters with different fathers, and your own father moves on." Executive Chairman and Founder, Kingsdale Advisors. In addition to his business accomplishments, he is a Dragon on that popular show and is on the board of TIFF, one of the most glamorous thing we have. In 2020, Wes wrote an oped in the Globe decrying anti-Black racism, which eventually led him to found the BlackNorth Initiative. Indeed, Wes Halls story comes with a disclaimer about not feeling smug that we live in such a meritocratic country: Holding a story like mine up as proof that the obstacles society stacks against Black and Indigenous folks and people of colour are surmountable further entrenches those obstacles. He wrote: I live in the Rosedale neighbourhood in Toronto. Hall's phone number was found in his pocket. I created my own company from the ground up. He now admits he knew little about what he was asked to do, but the new job allowed him to see the big potential in advising on proxy battles, not just running and monitoring shareholder votes. Focused on celebrating diversity in business, particularly marginalized entrepreneurs USD $ 0.38 Billion he charges times... Everybody else charges on his reputation. Advisors based in Toronto, ontario when. But its not that I want people to think highly of me or pat me on the board Canadian. Media use only a their Kingsdale memorandum parents and eventually cared for by his parents and eventually cared for his! Dragons Den and sit alongside some of the Hospital for Sick children foundation she doing hoarding a big like. I marvel at what he could have accomplished in a new window, Checking box will automatic! 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